Anyone Else Unbelievably Disappointed?

[varnon]

The keytar is a bastardized version of the piano and isn't a real instrument! You're not a real musician unless you're playing a piano!

Fixed!
But your reaganrgment of my logic is pretty close to what I actualy believe.

The thing is... how hard is it to make a note on a keyboard? Just press a button.
Lets compare that to a guitar. Well on guitar you can pluck an open note, or fret and pluck. Its a bit more difficult. Also, the crappier the guitar, the harder to fret. I know, I have a crappy guitar.
Other stringed instruments don't even have frets to guide you.
Woodwinds... I don't really know, used to played a clarinet in band for like a week. You have to blow into it, and cover up certian holes to even get a note, then change hole combinations to get different notes. Also, if you blow too hard it squeaks, so you have to blow right.
I think trumpet requires a certian way of holding your mouth, in addition to blowing at certian strengths and changing the fingering on the valves. It only has 3 valves, I'm actualy not really sure how you get so many pitches out of it.
I could keep going on forever, well... I'd probably have to stop at theramin.

So I really feel that anybody playing a keyboard interface should be able to play a bit more complex things compared to someone playing another instrument that has been playing as long. Keyboard is friggen EASY to start playing. Its only hard if you want to play two things at once, or if you want to do octave jumps and stuff like that. A simple melody on a keyboard interface is much much easier to play than on any other instrument.

[Rome]

varnon,

Are you saying that piano also has a short learning curve just because you only have to hit a key to make a sound?

Man that's the dumbest shit I've ever heard.

[varnon]

It has a short learning curve for easy stuff.
But its more difficult to master because both hands can make independent music.

[cesarsalad]

Well thanks for clarifying the synth jargon. I don't play or have one. I actualy found the part I'm talking about. It might actualy not be as easy to play as I thought, but its hard to hear exactly what it does. It doesn't sound like it takes a Liszt to actualy play it though.
The song is Spending Time, and somebody actualy recorded the show I was at (I didn't even notice!)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYLsSHz18Rs
Heres a link.
So everybody knows my extreme stance on performing only what you can perform. Okay, we got that, its extreme and not for everybody I know. But it was like the coolest keyboard part in the song, and I look over there and she is just holding down some keys and adjusting a knob. To me at least, thats not a cool thing to do. The machine is doing to work, not the person. I guess it doesn't actually make her a bad musician, I guess she can play all sorts of cool stuff outside of the band and I never know, but it was pretty dissapointing for me. I'm sure everybody does that crap, and almost every synth player I see only does that crap, but I thought Star actualy played that part. My bad.

NOBODY CAN FUCKING PLAY THAT PART IN REAL-TIME.

[bulb dylan]

It has a short learning curve for easy stuff.
But its more difficult to master because both hands can make independent music.

I think what is happening here is that you are experiencing reality. Sixteenth note arpeggios for 12 bars at 144-160 beats per minute is a stretch for even the most talented pianist. This is exactly the kind of thing arpeggiators were invented for. It seems as though you just now discovered what they were, what they do, and how often they do it without you realizing. There isn't any shame in that. I would cut Starthe band some slack though.

And if you can play those arpeggios, post them! I would love to see/hear them. Seriously.

Edit! 20 bars, actually!

[Not Jason]

Yeah, I knew that you were talking about spending time, and I think it would take a hell of a keyboardist to play that live.  I knew immediately when I heard that for the first time that it was either an arpegiator or something that was sequenced in a program or something.  Star has proven to me in various instances that she can play quick (DDD has a few), but to do it that fast and that cleanly across that range... that's the work of a robot.  The idea of somebody complaining that SYNTH isn't REAL enough is almost funny to me.  Sythesizers are all about high technology making things easier.  That's kind of at the core of what a synthesizer is.

Incidentally, you'd hate my live show.

As a bassist and guitarist of several years, I must protest to you saying they are harder instruments than keyboard.  Keyboard is easy to fake, yes, because it caters to a specific key signiture (so as long as you're playing in C major or an equivalent mode, you're always going to be in key if you avoid the black keys).  However, keyboard for me has always been a much harder instrument to do anything really substancial with.  It took me years of guitar to be even mediocre on piano.

[butterfly]

Well thanks for clarifying the synth jargon. I don't play or have one. I actualy found the part I'm talking about. It might actualy not be as easy to play as I thought, but its hard to hear exactly what it does. It doesn't sound like it takes a Liszt to actualy play it though.
The song is Spending Time, and somebody actualy recorded the show I was at (I didn't even notice!)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYLsSHz18Rs
Heres a link.
So everybody knows my extreme stance on performing only what you can perform. Okay, we got that, its extreme and not for everybody I know. But it was like the coolest keyboard part in the song, and I look over there and she is just holding down some keys and adjusting a knob. To me at least, thats not a cool thing to do. The machine is doing to work, not the person. I guess it doesn't actually make her a bad musician, I guess she can play all sorts of cool stuff outside of the band and I never know, but it was pretty dissapointing for me. I'm sure everybody does that crap, and almost every synth player I see only does that crap, but I thought Star actualy played that part. My bad.

NOBODY CAN FUCKING PLAY THAT PART IN REAL-TIME.

im not even sure why you bother looking this up. if you liked the music then just appreciate it cuz even if its programmed, then its obviously programmed by the person playing the instruments and that fair enuf cuz to me, that's already considered hard work.

[varnon]

I looked it up because I wanted to see what was actualy going on. And somebody here asked me what part I was talking about.
And sorry, but I think its really lame to play something you can't play.

[The Argyle Rebellion]

You're overanalyzing it, Varnon.

Enjoy the music for what it is: the collaboration of five people to create one united sound.  It doesn't matter if they can't play it live or if an arpeggiator is used or whatever; what matters is that they wrote it and it sounds good.  As Yellow Lightsaber said, sixteenth note arpeggios for twelve bars at 144-160 beats per minute is extremely hard/impossible to play, but if someone were to hit the keys and use an arpeggiator, could it still be said that they're playing because there's still the slightest level of skill involved to get those notes right?

Sincerely,
R.C.

[CT-700]

Thats what an arpeggiator is used for, and if they have one, why not use it? I mean its kind of like a delay pedal varnon. Not that a delay pedal and an arpeggiator do the same thing, but they both make certain things possible that are before almost physically impossible. So I ask you varnon, would you mind if Ryen had some killer solos on the new album which featured a delay pedal?

[tom]

Rivers Cuomo?...

[gloom-glaam]

It has a short learning curve for easy stuff.
But its more difficult to master because both hands can make independent music.

Doesn't everything easy have a short learning curve? I mean, isn't that why it's considered easy?

[varnon]

Lets say you are teaching someone totally new to music how to play a simple melody. Take "Marry had a Little Lamb" for an example. The students learning the melody on a keyboard interface are going to learn it a lot faster than students learning on say a violin. Thats what I mean.
And incidentaly that level of melody is what most keyboards in rock bands play. I used to play crap like that, I felt like an idiot playing stuff that simple and easy. I don't do it anymore.

[tom]

simple/hard has nothing to do with how well a certain melody sounds in a song.

[heysarahsarah]

I finally heard the new album.


Oh my god...I'm not just saying this, but it's seriously five times better than I ever thought it would be.  Production wise, it's probably one of the best PRODUCED albums they've done, though not as cohesive thematically as DDD.  Heartache vs Heartbreak made my jaw drop.  I couldn't believe it when it came on.  It was Ozma, but with like, a New Pornographers space age twist.  Incredible. 

The only track that isn't STELLAR is Fight the Darkness, which is still a fun song, with some great guitars as well.  Seriously, I have to wonder if some of you are even listening to the same album I am.  No harmonies are melodies?  What?

I think if I give this song a few more listens it may end up being my favorite over even DDD.  Yeah, I went there.


So, I guess I mean, I am about the most opposite of disappointed possible.  Ya'll be crazy.

[The Other Mike]

I think the anti-arpeggiator argument is my favorite argument of all time.

[heysarahsarah]

I think the anti-arpeggiator argument is my favorite argument of all time.

Anyone reminded of the organic music thread?  I think that was our deal boy Scott Peltz <3333

[noonchild]

I think the anti-arpeggiator argument is my favorite argument of all time.

Anyone reminded of the organic music thread?  I think that was our deal boy Scott Peltz <3333

It started out as me and Scott's argument but then Billy took over cause he's soooooooooo smart and oh so much more articulate than I.




...btw that wasn't sarcasm.

[Kris Danger]

Lets say you are teaching someone totally new to music how to play a simple melody. Take "Marry had a Little Lamb" for an example. The students learning the melody on a keyboard interface are going to learn it a lot faster than students learning on say a violin. Thats what I mean.
And incidentaly that level of melody is what most keyboards in rock bands play. I used to play crap like that, I felt like an idiot playing stuff that simple and easy. I don't do it anymore.

first off i just want to say you are an idiot which is probably a good indication as to why you felt like one. second i would like to see you program an arpeggiator considering you didn't even know what the hell it was, and i would like to see you create and modify sound waves using an analog synthesizer with any amount of skill during a live show (while singing a 5th to the lead when you can't fucking hear a god damn thing cuz the sound guy is off buying a drink at the bar) then say that playing a "keyboard" is easy.

[butterfly]

I finally heard the new album.


Oh my god...I'm not just saying this, but it's seriously five times better than I ever thought it would be.  Production wise, it's probably one of the best PRODUCED albums they've done, though not as cohesive thematically as DDD.  Heartache vs Heartbreak made my jaw drop.  I couldn't believe it when it came on.  It was Ozma, but with like, a New Pornographers space age twist.  Incredible. 

The only track that isn't STELLAR is Fight the Darkness, which is still a fun song, with some great guitars as well.  Seriously, I have to wonder if some of you are even listening to the same album I am.  No harmonies are melodies?  What?

I think if I give this song a few more listens it may end up being my favorite over even DDD.  Yeah, I went there.


So, I guess I mean, I am about the most opposite of disappointed possible.  Ya'll be crazy.

geez i dun know. im not saying its a bad album. it is new only that i dun think it's as great as their previous realease that's all.
the thing about a good realease is that, you dun need a few listen to even appreciate the album even if its somethin new that the band is trying out. for example...take the band hellogoodbye. their latest realease is way far from their previous album but i totally enjoyed it when i first heard it.

but what the heck, ive already got my ozma cd (thats for not thinking before grabbing it off the shelves) and i just have to try to enjoy it since ive already paid for them.

[FireAarro]

I finally heard the new album.


Oh my god...I'm not just saying this, but it's seriously five times better than I ever thought it would be.  Production wise, it's probably one of the best PRODUCED albums they've done, though not as cohesive thematically as DDD.  Heartache vs Heartbreak made my jaw drop.  I couldn't believe it when it came on.  It was Ozma, but with like, a New Pornographers space age twist.  Incredible. 

The only track that isn't STELLAR is Fight the Darkness, which is still a fun song, with some great guitars as well.  Seriously, I have to wonder if some of you are even listening to the same album I am.  No harmonies are melodies?  What?

I think if I give this song a few more listens it may end up being my favorite over even DDD.  Yeah, I went there.


So, I guess I mean, I am about the most opposite of disappointed possible.  Ya'll be crazy.

geez i dun know. im not saying its a bad album. it is new only that i dun think it's as great as their previous realease that's all.
the thing about a good realease is that, you dun need a few listen to even appreciate the album even if its somethin new that the band is trying out. for example...take the band hellogoodbye. their latest realease is way far from their previous album but i totally enjoyed it when i first heard it.

but what the heck, ive already got my ozma cd (thats for not thinking before grabbing it off the shelves) and i just have to try to enjoy it since ive already paid for them.

Most of the music I love took me a few listens to get into. Most things do for me, really.

[Not Jason]

Lets say you are teaching someone totally new to music how to play a simple melody. Take "Marry had a Little Lamb" for an example. The students learning the melody on a keyboard interface are going to learn it a lot faster than students learning on say a violin. Thats what I mean.
And incidentaly that level of melody is what most keyboards in rock bands play. I used to play crap like that, I felt like an idiot playing stuff that simple and easy. I don't do it anymore.

first off i just want to say you are an idiot which is probably a good indication as to why you felt like one. second i would like to see you program an arpeggiator considering you didn't even know what the hell it was, and i would like to see you create and modify sound waves using an analog synthesizer with any amount of skill during a live show (while singing a 5th to the lead when you can't fucking hear a god damn thing cuz the sound guy is off buying a drink at the bar) then say that playing a "keyboard" is easy.

BANG!

[Oatmeal]

geez i dun know. im not saying its a bad album. it is new only that i dun think it's as great as their previous realease that's all.
the thing about a good realease is that, you dun need a few listen to even appreciate the album even if its somethin new that the band is trying out. for example...take the band hellogoodbye. their latest realease is way far from their previous album but i totally enjoyed it when i first heard it.

but what the heck, ive already got my ozma cd (thats for not thinking before grabbing it off the shelves) and i just have to try to enjoy it since ive already paid for them.

I kind of liked weezers old stuff when I first heard it. However it took me a number of listens to really enjoy it, now those songs are some of my favorite out there (and that was the first weezer stuff I got into). At the time I didnt like things that were not very heavy. The album changed my opinion. The same with the older ozma albums. The same with the beatles. Most of my favorite bands took some time before I really enjoyed them. Thats becuase they usualy alter some musical bias. This new album may not be my favorite ozma album but I enjoy it and my opinion in changing as I listen. Give it time.

[butterfly]

geez i dun know. im not saying its a bad album. it is new only that i dun think it's as great as their previous realease that's all.
the thing about a good realease is that, you dun need a few listen to even appreciate the album even if its somethin new that the band is trying out. for example...take the band hellogoodbye. their latest realease is way far from their previous album but i totally enjoyed it when i first heard it.

but what the heck, ive already got my ozma cd (thats for not thinking before grabbing it off the shelves) and i just have to try to enjoy it since ive already paid for them.

I kind of liked weezers old stuff when I first heard it. However it took me a number of listens to really enjoy it, now those songs are some of my favorite out there (and that was the first weezer stuff I got into). At the time I didnt like things that were not very heavy. The album changed my opinion. The same with the older ozma albums. The same with the beatles. Most of my favorite bands took some time before I really enjoyed them. Thats becuase they usualy alter some musical bias. This new album may not be my favorite ozma album but I enjoy it and my opinion in changing as I listen. Give it time.

true, i dun this its gonna be a great realease but i'll give credit for the fact that i'm listening to new ozma songs.

[H0wl]

Pasadena is a brilliant album, and it makes me shiver when I hear its brilliance.

[I Like Ozma]

if an album makes you shiver, then you got problems kid.

[Oatmeal]

I found my myself shightly shivering several times when I listened to weezer and ozma before. I aslo found my self doing so on the moving part of good movies. Maybee I should see a doctor.

[parker]

I found my myself shightly shivering several times when I listened to weezer and ozma before. I aslo found my self doing so on the moving part of good movies. Maybee I should see a doctor.

I think this album is boring and uninspired.

[Oatmeal]

Your not including uderneath my tree right? Lunchbreak?

[I Like Ozma]

yes elliott you should see a doctor about that whole shivering thing...